1998 130 hard to start cold

[Chuck1234]

Update. Disconnected fuel line from carb. Cranked-fuel pump working good. Hand primer-same. Reconnected fuel line reprimed, pulled drain plugs from both carbs- seemed to be plenty fuel in both. Installed plugs, reprimed, then tried to start motor. Tried level, tilted, choked, not choked, with advance and without. Nothing different. Using wd 40 as a starting fluid, cranked and motor stated after turning over a few times . And after it started first time starts easily thereafter.
Before I tackle carb rebuild, any other ideas? Also, if anyone has any pointers for the rebuild, they will be appreciated.

[Chuck1234]

Update. With motor cold, sprayed some gas oil mixture into both carbs, choked, hit starter. Motor fired right up.

[panasonic]

Update. With motor cold, sprayed some gas oil mixture into both carbs, choked, hit starter. Motor fired right up.

You are going to have to remove and clean out the choke circuit/passages in your carbs. They are blocked.

[Chuck1234]

You are going to have to remove and clean out the choke circuit/passages in your carbs. They are blocked.

Ok. Thanks.

[Chuck1234]

Now we're getting somewhere!

+1 on cleaning the carbs. Pay close attention to the orifices and use an air compressor if available. R&R jets to visually inspect. You MUST be able to see light thru them...

I suspect it's more of an orifice clogged up..

Please update on your progress.

Will do. Any advice on which kit to buy or any to avoid? I know from other small engine carb rebuilds that some kits are lacking in parts you need. Don't want to purchase a kit only to find that the needle valve (or other necessary item) is not included.

[99yam40]

You are going to have to remove and clean out the choke circuit/passages in your carbs. They are blocked.

I do not remember seeing any choke passages in any carb.
The choke plates close off restricting the air flow while turning the motor over which causes the vacuum pulled on carb throats to suck fuel out of the idle and main jet passages.

Do you know if the carbs came from your 97 or from a 98 power head he put on?

I would stick to Yamaha parts, but they do not always come with everything needed.

i would start out pulling them apart and inspecting it all to see what you need before ordering.

most of the time you do not need much and it ends up cheaper buying the individual parts needed.

a lot of yamaha carbs use o rings as gaskets and can be reused, but I have no idea about a 130 97 or 98

[panasonic]

I do not remember seeing any choke passages in any carb.
The choke plates close off restricting the air flow while turning the motor over which causes the vacuum pulled on carb throats to suck fuel out of the idle and main jet passages.

Do you know if the carbs came from your 97 or from a 98 power head he put on?

I would stick to Yamaha parts, but they do not always come with everything needed.

i would start out pulling them apart and inspecting it all to see what you need before ordering.

most of the time you do not need much and it ends up cheaper buying the individual parts needed.

a lot of yamaha carbs use o rings as gaskets and can be reused, but I have no idea about a 130 97 or 98

I am stuck in motorcycle mode, some which have dedicated choke or enrichment passages.

I should have said: "take the carbs apart and make sure all the circuits are clean."

99yam40 is absolutely correct in saying:

"The choke plates close off restricting the air flow while turning the motor over which causes the vacuum pulled on carb throats to suck fuel out of the idle and main jet passages"

[Chuck1234]

As the parts fisch show's:

1997 S130TLRV Yamaha Outboard CARBURETOR Diagram and Parts

You do have paper gaskets for the float bowls.

I would pull them apart first before buying anything. Most times, they can be simply cleaned and re-assembled.

Obviously, the spritz of fuel while cold and starting immediately, confirmed a fueling issue. Yes the choke butterfly closes, but that should richen the mix, which it isn't..

I use brake cleaner if there's any orifices with rubber parts in them, carb cleaner for the rest. Just make sure all passages are clear...

If you know someone with a sonic cleaner, that wouldn't hurt either...

Count the # of turns for ANY air screw you remove. Lightly seat it, counting the turns for later installation..

The paper bowl gasket should go on the carb body BEFORE you reinstall the floats/needles. Make sure they don't hang up on you..

*Fuel systems, ESPECIALLY CARBS, are about the biggest issue especially with today's crap ethanol fuel...

Yup I learned about ethanol the hard way. Like many others, I drank the Kool aid until it got a few carbs. Thanks for the advice.

[Chuck1234]

I do not remember seeing any choke passages in any carb.
The choke plates close off restricting the air flow while turning the motor over which causes the vacuum pulled on carb throats to suck fuel out of the idle and main jet passages.

Do you know if the carbs came from your 97 or from a 98 power head he put on?

I would stick to Yamaha parts, but they do not always come with everything needed.

i would start out pulling them apart and inspecting it all to see what you need before ordering.

most of the time you do not need much and it ends up cheaper buying the individual parts needed.

a lot of yamaha carbs use o rings as gaskets and can be reused, but I have no idea about a 130 97 or 98

Don't know if the carb is the original or came with the 98 powerhead. Now, IF the jets are clean, what else would cause carb to not pick up gas when choked?

[boscoe99]

Don't know if the carb is the original or came with the 98 powerhead. Now, IF the jets are clean, what else would cause carb to not pick up gas when choked?

There are many many tiny passageways throughout the carburetor. All of which need to be free and clear. Air passages, fuel passages and air/fuel passages. They all work together.

I find a heated ultrasonic cleaner with a good cleaning solution to be useful. After the cleaning process you can use spray carburetor cleaner to help back flush any passageways that might need help in opening up. Take some marine copper wire, strip the insulation off, and then take a strand or two to use to rod out the passageways.

Make sure the float height is within specifications. Fuel level being on the low side can cause less fuel to be drawn into the system, right at the time when extra fuel is needed.

Here is a representative illustration of a Yamaha carburetor. They can be fairly complex inside. Cross the fingers.

[99yam40]

I just think that a motor that runs very good at all rpm and starts very well all of the time except when cold would not have plugged passages/jets that are keeping the choke from working.
vacuum leak when cold maybe, or something else could be going on.
those large holes only in bottom choke plates make me wonder if that has something to do with this.

being i chased a fuel problem( high speed miss) with my C40 for almost a year before finding someone drilled out the main jets makes me think nothing can be ruled out when dealing with used motors that you have no idea what was done to them before you got your hands on them.

did the op check compression and timing?
He said the previous owner tried all sorts of things but failed, so no telling what all was don to this motor that had parts from other years put on it

[boscoe99]

[panasonic]

Don't know if the carb is the original or came with the 98 powerhead. Now, IF the jets are clean, what else would cause carb to not pick up gas when choked?

Do you by chance have a service manual for this engine?

If so, it may have a fuel/air flow diagram of the carburetor in there somewhere.

If you have such a diagram could you possibly take a picture of it and post it?

Thanks.

[panasonic]

One last thing you can try to confirm its a dirty carbs causing this trouble is as follows:

With the engine cold, as you have been doing, the air box removed, choke plates closed. Put your hand over the two large holes in the bottom choke plate and see if it starts or try's to start.

Closing off those two large holes in the choke plate will increase the vacuum created in the carb venturi, which may pull enough fuel through the idle/main jets to get it to fire off...maybe.

It seems a little strange it wont start, but after it gets going from priming, it runs well enough.

I still think you have a clogged circuit, but maybe just partially.

Best of luck

[Chuck1234]

Do you by chance have a service manual for this engine?

If so, it may have a fuel/air flow diagram of the carburetor in there somewhere.

If you have such a diagram could you possibly take a picture of it and post it?

Thanks.

Have Yamaha service manual. Not much in carb department. Rough breakdown pic. Tells you to disassemble and clean without any details. Tells you the float setting. Not much else.