2006 f250 txr no spark

[johnny1984]

Hi, I hope someone can help me, I bought a pair of Yamaha F250 txr 2006. I trusted the dealer and this was a mistake! he told me that the motors were fine only 350 hours, they looked good..he had painted them! When the motors arrived in Mexico the transmission in the starboard motor was full of water and metal debris, I had to buy a lower unit and have this sent to Mexico. Now when they were fitted this starboard motor ran for a while and stopped and would not start again, then the starter motor broke, so got a new one, started for a while after 10 mins stopped and would not start, mechanic said change low pressure pump and high pressure pump and filters. Started for a few minutes and stopped and would not start. I read on this forum that it might be a bad connection somewhere! Tried squirting starter fluid in the intake, would not fire, so new pumps and filters, but no spark!....any Ideas?

[99yam40]

are compression/ leak down test, spark, & fuel pressures OK.
could be sucking air into fuel system if spark and compression and timing are good and the motors are spinning over fast enough

[johnny1984]

Ok I am not even an amature mechanic, I can only repeat what the mechanic tells me, sorry.

Have replaced starter motor, low and high pressure pumps so, am pretty sure its not fuel related. Sprayed easy start in the intake did not fire, so there is no spark. What do you think we should look at?

[99yam40]

test for spark when cranking the motor over when it will not start, monitor the fuel pressure at that time also.
guessing and throwing parts at it is the wrong thing to do.
testing is needed

[rodbolt17]

if it wont at least pop with starting fluid it may well lack spark.

what makes spark?

12v on the ign coiul primary and inputs from the pulser and crank position sensor.
at key on the main relay is energized applying 12V to any yellow/red wire, fuel pumps injectors and ign coils in particular.
now based on various signals(ECU ground paths) various devices turn on and off.

spark testers can be made.

service manuals contain vast amounts of information.

a digital multi-meter is priceless.

OR
stand back and toss wads o cash at it.
eventually you may hit the correct part.
then you will go back and try to figure out the dreaded technician induced problems.

did you do the right thing and rig it with command link?

[johnny1984]

I am in the hands of the mechanic, he says we need to change this, we change it. I have little or no knowledge of outboard motors.. I am in Puerto Aventuras, good Yamaha mechanics are a bit thin on the ground. I am sure the mechanic is doing his best but he is stumped. I will ask him to check what you have suggested and I am really most grateful for your help. I read on another forum that you, rodbolt, are a first class Yamaha technician, dont you get fed up with people like me (all the gear and no Idea!) asking for help... I just want to fish.

[rodbolt17]

do I get fed up?
OOOOOPO ell ya.
can I get sarchastic?
YEP.
however after working a few winters in VE I understand no training in the product.
0 training in any electronics.
no parts.
they are winging it with 70's technology.
right now I am in Mobile AL, 967 nmiles from home.
my mom is terminally ill.


a few questions.
does your tech have a Yamaha service manual for that engine, not a generic Clymer/seloc?

does your tech have a digital meter?

does the boat have command link gauges?

there are no codes,well actual;ly 1 but no one has ever seen it, that will cut off spark.
that 1 code there is no real data on, some years back we simulated it in class, only because I asked a dumb question based on the VOLVO egc/EVC.

[johnny1984]

I am so sorry to hear about your mum, I lost mine, maybe same thing? some years back, think about her and miss her every day.

My problems are nothing! but thanks for your help I appreciate it.

Oh and Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit...but the most effective!
I will speak to the Mechanic tomorrow.

I think you are nearer to me, than you are to your home?

[rodbolt17]

Mobile AL is a LOOOONG way from our southern border.
if the tech does NOT have the genuine Yamaha service manual get one.
all the systems other than cam position can be tested with the SM, paper clips a digital volt meter some jumper leads and an understanding of how each subsystem works and how it affects operation.

once I get back to the shop I can look at my manual and give better assistance.

[johnny1984]

wish you were here.

[rodbolt17]

just remember that at key on any yellow/red wire will have 12V to ground.
the transistors in the ECU switch ign coil current on and off just like a set of points in a 1970 w30 olds.
the coil over plug has a unique feature of a zener diode, it makes the secondary firing voltage a minimum of 32KV.
at key on the HP pump should whine for about 3 seconds.
after that you should hear the throttle body whine.
does the alarm system work?
to test pull the lanyard and crank it.
you should get an audible alarm.
if the lanyard is shorted and the alarm horn not in place the ign wont work nor will the fuel system but it will crank over.,
the system is designed to alert the operator if the ECU sees a crank and a stop signal at the same time.
it will react to both however.
it will crank but it wont start,

[99yam40]

seems like it will start and run but dies and will not restart.
if you leave it alone for some time will it start up again?

sounds like running out of fuel, but the starting fluid should have made it fire if that was true.
I guess it could be flooding, once that happens I am not sure if the starting fluid would get it to fire.

Rodbolt's advice will be the most help I am sure
Best to make sure there is spark or not when it will not start. KV tester would be nice, but do not think they will have one.
Not sure about the use of the zener, guess it has to reach the 32KV before it lets it go to plug


Do you here as Rodbolt said the pump and throttle body make noise when it will not start?
But that should not matter if it is a spark problem

[rodbolt17]

99
ya aint lissenen.
the same 12V yellow/red wires that provide 12V+DC to all six coils also supply power to the throttle body and the HP pump and a few other things.
it is all taken from a connector block.
feed one in and jumper a bunch.
so if I were to turn the key on and did not hear the HP pump OR the throttle body I would assume it probably wont spark either cause the coiuls most likely lost 12v as well.
it is easy to check.
the SM actually has a decent diagram.

when tracing wires in the diagram it is easier to trace device to source and device to ground.

about the only thing I can think of to lose spark is the kill circuit is on or you lost power to the yellow/red junction block.

that block is about 1/2"thick about 3"wide and about 3" tall.
some motors use several for various + and - paths.

[johnny1984]

still looking for the spark! Where is the the yellow/red junction block located? I have 2 motors so kill switch is not the problem. Tried swapping the relays and ECU no good, ...checked the compression all 175. both pumps working.

One thing, the motor, when it ran was not giving a charge to the battery! ...significant?

[rodbolt17]

when you turn the key(s) on do you hear an audible alarm?

do you get an alarm when cranking?
you should get an alarm self test when key is turned on.

this aint hard nor rocket science but if your not careful while randomly jacking cwap between engines you will have to find the original issue and the technician induced ones.

that is why I rarely ever switch parts.
it to simple to trouble shoot it.