F90 Broke Again, I give Up

[FLCoyote]

Long story trying to be short. When I bought my 2005 F90, the owner had it for 89 days and had used it twice. I though I had hit the jackpot. That was in 2006. Since then I've had problem after problem with the motor. I have done routine oil and lower unit lubes and had routine service performed by a dealer. Last Friday was the proverbial last straw. For the third time in two years the motor started idling at 2000PM and shifting very hard due to high RPM's. I was about 10 miles offshore so forced it into gear and hightailed it back to the ramp. Put it in the shop Saturday morning. First time this happened it cost me $2200, that was for a new wiring harness and a lower unit rebuild caused by forcing it into gear so I could get back in, didn't work anyway and Sea Tow ended up towing me about 14 miles. About six months later the high idle problem came back. I took the motor into the dealer who replaced the Wiring Harness and was informed that I needed another wiring harness, I was also informed the Yamaha doesn't warrant electrical parts and that the dealer is prohibited from repair on the wiring harness. After I raised a sufficient amount of rage the dealer agreed to fix the harness and did for only $125. Kicker is they repaired it with a piece of my original harness they had kept from the first replacement. The exact problem repeated last Saturday and I can't wait to hear the diagnosis and estimated repair costs. The list of repairs I've had done to this motor is ridiculous. I haven't abused it and probably average 100 hours a year on the motor. My dealer tells me that there is a known problem with the F90 Wiring Harnesses, so why doesn't Yamaha do something about it? Anyway I'm certainly not a Yamaha fan and my boat is going on the market as soon as I get it out of the shop. I've spend between $4000 and $6000 on various repairs, none of which resulted from abuse. At this point I no longer have any confidence in my F90 and certainly am not going off shore again with it. This is the end of my rant. Bottom line for me is if the Wiring Harness problem is known to Yamaha? Why haven't they done a recall or a tech bulletin or something. I don't think that a $695 part plus labor is something that F90 owners should just accept.

FLCoyote

[boscoe99]

Just as a point of reference it might be better to knowingly start the motor in gear (at idle RPM of course) rather than try and shift the motor into gear at high RPM. With the possibility of damaging the lower unit. Do this knowingly of course and only in a difficult situation when needed to get back in.

Yamaha has updated the wire harness several times trying to make it more reliable.

Yamaha does not prevent a dealer from doing a repair on the motor if the motor is out of warranty. That is the customers/dealers call. For a motor in warranty Yamaha's procedure is to replace a defective part rather than repair it.

Recalls are for safety items.

A tech bulletin is for a problem that is widely happening. The F90 wire harness issue is not that widespread. Most don't have it. The few that do however suffer.

[99yam40]

you need to find out what part of the harness is the problem and what is causing it to malfunction.

I believe I have read on the F90 that when pulling and reinstalling the cowling if not careful you will hang a part of it and damage the connector to one of the sensors. it this is the problem you need to make sure the harness is tied down properly and be extra careful when moving the cowling.

maybe Boscoe can say if I am correct on this

[boscoe99]

That was it. Cowling would snag on the wiring and damage either the wiring or the connection to a terminal. Terminal for the idle air control valve.

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Great catch 99Yam!

I'm curious if they put the latest harness in AND, as posted above did the DEALER secure THAT SECTION of the harness prone to snagging??

If they did not install that part correctly, (zip tied it or what ever Yamaha calls for), I'd be raising hell...


And as previously posted, if the idle isn't down to normal, clicking into gear at 2K, count on spending $2k at least...

Also, if there's another dealer around, I'd probably be knocking on his door... After the first "fix" that failed, he's a "parts ONLY shop" in my book..

And, IMO, if you paid for new parts(not under warranty), KEEP THEM.


Curious, did the dealer say exactly what was wrong with the harness(s)???

[pstephens46]

Is this one of the issues that Rod mentioned will cause the motor to lock rpm to 2000? Can't recall

[FLCoyote]

F90 Update

This time I took the boat to a Certified Yamaha Mechanic who works out of his garage and is well thought of by local boaters. He hasn't checked it out yet and I'm hoping its a simple and inexpensive repair. If it is reasonable and the lower unit isn't damaged? I'm going to get the boat detailed and put it on the market. So far, BOAT=Break out another thousand and I'm done. Probably get a 14 foot Jon boat with a 25 on the back and a good *****ing motor on the bow. If the repair on this problem is greater than $2000, I'll try to sell the boat, motor and aluminum trailer as is to someone that has enough mechanical skills to maintain it. I put my Kayak in the water yesterday morning and caught two nice Largemouth Bass. That helped me get over being disgusted with my boat, Yamaha in general and the dealer I've been using for my maintenance issues. I'm retired and just not ready for the high cost of keeping my Center Console in shape. I really appreciate the comments on this thread, but I'm really done and won't be posting anymore on this issue.
It will probably be a relief to sign the title over.

[boscoe99]

The two happiest days of a boat owners life are the day the boat is bought and the day the boat is sold.

[TownsendsFJR1300]

If you wouldn't mind, could you post what the issue / fix was?

Thanks and good luck...

[boscoe99]

How about some photos of the boat and motor? What brand, age, etc.?

[Jason2tpa]

Is this one of the issues that Rod mentioned will cause the motor to lock rpm to 2000? Can't recall

This is first I'm hearing an engine can experience rpm "lock". If such occurred with a carb engine, isn't it possible to completely loosen the throttle idle screw? And if further adjustment is required to lower the locked rpms, turn out the idle mix screws to drop rpms?

I know this guy's engine is a 4 stroke, thus not a carb engine. I'm not as familiar with 4 stroke engines idle rpm adjustments as 2 strokes, but isn't there some manual adjustment he could have made to lower rpms? Kinda a scary scenario if not.

[pstephens46]

My terminology is wrong but has something to do with a failed sensor. I was hoping someone might clarify.

[TownsendsFJR1300]

This is first I'm hearing an engine can experience rpm "lock". If such occurred with a carb engine, isn't it possible to completely loosen the throttle idle screw? And if further adjustment is required to lower the locked rpms, turn out the idle mix screws to drop rpms?

I know this guy's engine is a 4 stroke, thus not a carb engine. I'm not as familiar with 4 stroke engines idle rpm adjustments as 2 strokes, but isn't there some manual adjustment he could have made to lower rpms? Kinda a scary scenario if not.

My F150's idle (as is MANY others) is con*****ed by the Idle Control Valve ICV.

There is no "idle screw" to adjust back. The computer sends signals to the ICV depending on inputs from other sensors...

Thus, all the threads on low idle (especially the F150). It's NOT just a simple screw adjustment. There's adjustment with the throttle position sensor as well as others monitoring with the YDS (PIA)...

Not seeing his engine in person, I'd look (TRY) at tricking the engine to thinking it's in neutral when it's in forward gear. It would start in gear, run, no impact to the LU, would be very tricky docking thou but would get you home....

I keep my HARD copy shop manual on board, just for something like this.

[Jason2tpa]

It would start in gear, run, no impact to the LU, would be very tricky docking thou but would get you home....

Don't all modern Yam's have a neutral safety switch or interlock, preventing engine from starting in gear? Unless you're saying you'd bypass this safety mechanism.

I know my '98 cannot start in gear, and I assume all motors manufactured since also include this safety feature.

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Don't all modern Yam's have a neutral safety switch or interlock, preventing engine from starting in gear? Unless you're saying you'd bypass this safety mechanism.

I know my '98 cannot start in gear, and I assume all motors manufactured since also include this safety feature.

That's exactly what I'd do. Beats paying Seatow big $'s. (I wouldn't have left the dock if it wouldn't idle down, period)...

Bypass it (if possible). Ie, after having issues with my starter relay(since replaced it), I know now how to by pass it altogether and start the engine and have a "jumper" in my boat tool box..

Most walk behind lawn mowers in the last 15 years have a handle you need to hold to keep it running (safety switch). Removed it, toggle on/off (as I'm the only one that uses it).