2003 Z150TRLB ECM Main Relay Issue

[rejesterd]

Can you explain how you would test the ECM? You seemed to recommend peak voltage testing here:

http://www.yamahaoutboardparts.com/f...6665#post76665

I understand your question, but I don't know the answer. This is the point where I'm following the manual. But that procedure has been printed in TCI Yamaha engines for at least 15 years. Seems like they should have corrected it by now..

Maybe you can explain how you would test peak voltage. But that thread seems like a similar issue and rodbolt suggested it might be the ECM.

[boscoe99]

[99yam40]

Yes I was mistaken on that motor having a TCI 12V system instead of a CDI as I was use to.

OK just saw Boscoes post, and it seems there is some voltage spiking on the primary side, so Rejesterd is correct that 12 v turns into over 200 because of the spikes that can be read with a peak meter.

I have never read a manual on the TCI

Seems like we all are learning new stuff every day on this place

[rejesterd]

Cool thanks for correcting me. So I think we can conclude that the ECM output peak voltage test is a valid one.

[boscoe99]

I cannot.

My guess is that the Yamaha SM is incorrect. The test procedure seems to have been written for a two stroke CDI ignition system. Yamagucchi the SM writer probably does not know a CDI from a TCI from his arse. Hey, the HPDI is a two stroke so shirley it must use a two stroke CDI system.

[rejesterd]

I think Mr. Nice Guy's manual will confirm if it's TCI or CDI. Hopefully he chimes in. But in looking at parts for his model, it says it has an ECM. For all the CDI models I've seen, it's called a "CDI unit" not ECM.

[rejesterd]

I have never read a manual on the TCI

I think most F-models in the last 15 years are TCI. The manual for my 2011 F50 TLR mentions it in the General Specifications chapter under the Power Unit sub-section.

Ignition System: TCI
Advance System: Microcomputer

Also, I did find a manual for a Z200 from 1999, but it doesn't specify. It just says:

Ignition Control System: Microcomputer

Maybe the 2003 manual will clarify.

[99yam40]

been drinking beer and eating BBQ and thinking about this some.

I have no idea what motors use TCI .

there is some voltage spiking that happens into coils when collapsing and energizing fields happen
and in this system it happens in very fast time frames.
I never fully understood the concept, but know it is there.

I have no idea what a low reading would mean or a high one.
possible a shorted winding could produce a low reading, but not sure.
I was not an electrical engineer in the past or present.

[rodbolt17]

points were a switch operated by a cam.
TCI simply uses a transistor switch.
if you are quick enough you could simply plug and unplug a wire.
it simply allows current to flow through the ign coil primary.
now at key on you will see about 12v peak.
running,due the the "ringing" you will see about 150-200V.
the injector driver is a simple step up transformer.
you should see about 60-90v peak when cranking or running.
don't get you panties in a wad over TCI vs CDI. they both do the same thing.

[pstephens46]

been drinking beer and eating BBQ and thinking about this some.

I have no idea what motors use TCI .

there is some voltage spiking that happens into coils when collapsing and energizing fields happen
and in this system it happens in very fast time frames.
I never fully understood the concept, but know it is there.

I have no idea what a low reading would mean or a high one.
possible a shorted winding could produce a low reading, but not sure.
I was not an electrical engineer in the past or present.

Let me skootch in here. More importantly, what kind of BBQ?

[99yam40]

It was just home made Deer sausage and some chicken,
I am out of brisket. need to cook one up again
I call it BBQ because I smoked/cooked it on my BBQ pit.

thinking about it some more this morning and this higher voltage on the 12 v primary side of the ignition coils probably should be seen on automotive ignition systems also,
and then I see Rodbolts post this morning too.
so I am fairly sure if someone used a peak reading meter made for outboards hooked to their automobile ignition system coil you would read a higher voltage there also

[Mr. Nice Guy]

For anyone still following this thread... turns out the ECM was bad... replaced the unit and everything is working!

[rejesterd]

Cool man.. thanks for the update. Yes, I was still wondering about this, for sure.

[rodbolt17]

hahahaa 8 pages and two different diagrams and it was all in something tha6 should have taken 30min. however I just was spell boung with the mis information and total lack of understang HPDI.
actually HPDI isn't much harder than an old 3.5Hp BS with a flo-jet.
does the same thing. suck.
squeeze.
bang.
blow.

what does that relay do and why is it there?
is it cause someones bro-inlaw sells relays and needs the money to move out?????
my guess actually would be along the lines of using a very small control current to control a fairly large one.
otherwise the ECM heatsink would be as large as the motor.
but hey that is just my guess.
first thought when a see a cracked relay is OH MY the untrained have had the skinners all over this.

BUT when you bypassed the relay and it fired up and ran should have been a BAM moment.
as in BAM it is the relay control circuit.
either it does not have 12V+ OR the ground path to the ECU is bad or the ECU is bad.
30 min tops.
you should have plugged into the 12v control socket to ground, if 12v was shown move the ground lead to the relay control ground socket and turn on the key.
12v or that path has failed.
remember when you energize the Key the ECU wakes up and energizes every relay on the motor except the trim.
but yes getting the relay out without cracking it is difficult.
pliers simply crack them.

[boscoe99]

hahahaa 8 pages and two different diagrams and it was all in something tha6 should have taken 30min. however I just was spell boung with the mis information and total lack of understang HPDI.

Have you ever thought of submitting some articles for the onboard magazine? How to test circuits for instance? Voltage drop?