oil seal installation

[Algenon49]

Hi Guys,

I have a small 2 stroke 4hp Aux engine, so i'm replacing the water impeller, whilst doing this i decided to replace the two drive shaft oil seals which are located under the impeller , now in my haste I've forgotten how they go back in, i.e which way does the spring side go, I've looked at a diagram i believe is relevant to this model ( 6EO) and it shows the two oil seals installed with the spring side facing upwards towards the head, so that confused me as i would have thought it would've been the other way round,
I need a sanity check before i put them in according to the diagram

Thanks

Alan

[rodbolt17]

springs face up.

[boscoe99]

The seals are oriented to keep water out. Not necessarily to keep oil in. But if they will keep water out then by so doing they will automatically keep oil in. The oil level will be well below the bottom of the seals anyway. Same with the drive shaft oil seals as well except they will be in contact with oil.

Capiche?

Let the parts catalog (available online to everyone) be your guide. For instance,

[Algenon49]

Thanks for that guys, just wanted to be sure!!

Alan

[Masonmobilemarine]

Boscoe....I disagree.

I don't think by simply keeping water out that it will automatically keep oil in. There's no science to that, and the seals have different designs depending on which way the fluid is going.

I know Yamaha likes it their way, but I always install back to back (one each way). Keep water out and oil in.

Way my instructor taught me, and just how I do it. Most every other makes do it that way. Yammy is just the child that likes to be different imo.

[boscoe99]

Boscoe....I disagree.

I don't think by simply keeping water out that it will automatically keep oil in. There's no science to that, and the seals have different designs depending on which way the fluid is going.

I know Yamaha likes it their way, but I always install back to back (one each way). Keep water out and oil in.

Way my instructor taught me, and just how I do it. Most every other makes do it that way. Yammy is just the child that likes to be different imo.

Well, you and Yamaha/me will just have to agree to disagree. So it goes.

Rodnut may come along and tell us that we are both crazy.

[rodbolt17]

for years Yamaha faces both springs out.
every other manufacturer I ever worked on was one in one out.
disagree all you wish but look in the SM.

[boscoe99]

Somewhere there is a mechanic that espouses having both seals facing inward. Thinking that it is more important to keep oil in than water out. I little bit of water getting in won't hurt. Run low on oil and it will be the kiss of death.

Billy Bob Backyardigan Bozo instructor/mechanic told him to do it thisaway so that to him is the rightaway. Ain't nothin gonna change his mind.

We are free in boating and automobiles to do as we wish. Freedom. Good, bad or indifferent.

[Masonmobilemarine]

Somewhere there is a mechanic that espouses having both seals facing inward. Thinking that it is more important to keep oil in than water out. I little bit of water getting in won't hurt. Run low on oil and it will be the kiss of death.

Billy Bob Backyardigan Bozo instructor/mechanic told him to do it thisaway so that to him is the rightaway. Ain't nothin gonna change his mind.

We are free in boating and automobiles to do as we wish. Freedom. Good, bad or indifferent.

Really? Why do we have to stoop to insults?

Its a simple conversation we we're having where I respectfully disagreed and gave reasoning as to why.

Agree to disagree, that's fine. I wasn't even trying to change anybody's mind, just conversation. Yet, just for the simple reason that you disagree you stoop to name calling and belittling somebody you don't know a single thing about.

Wow, pretty childish huh? I thought you all were grown adults here?

[walleye1]

Mercury installs there seals opposite each other.

[boscoe99]

Mercury installs there seals opposite each other.

And the point is ?

[boscoe99]

Really? Why do we have to stoop to insults?

Its a simple conversation we we're having where I respectfully disagreed and gave reasoning as to why.

Agree to disagree, that's fine. I wasn't even trying to change anybody's mind, just conversation. Yet, just for the simple reason that you disagree you stoop to name calling and belittling somebody you don't know a single thing about.

Wow, pretty childish huh? I thought you all were grown adults here?

Not trying to direct insults to you or anyone. Others may come along and read this post. The message to them is to not automatically believe something just because someone (maybe a mechanic) says that is the way to do it.

I come out of aviation. Planes crash and people get hurt or killed whenever manufacturer's guidance is ignored. There are laws against it. Yes, we are not talking airplanes here but the basic principle is the same.

[Masonmobilemarine]

Not trying to direct insults to you or anyone. Others may come along and read this post. The message to them is to not automatically believe something just because someone (maybe a mechanic) says that is the way to do it.

I come out of aviation. Planes crash and people get hurt or killed whenever manufacturer's guidance is ignored. There are laws against it. Yes, we are not talking airplanes here but the basic principle is the same.

Just because you say you're not trying to directly insult anybody, doesn't change the fact that you did.

You're calling my instructor and myself backyard bozos. Your words. You don't know anything about me or my Instructor. You know know that he's ran his own successful business for 35+ years. And nothing about me.

So to simply throw insults and write us off just because your opinion is different is just unnecessary...and is just rude. No way around it, it's rude.

I acknowledged in my own post that, that isn't the way Yamaha does it. I was simply adding conversation into the mix.


Not everything manufacturers do is always right. If that was the case there would never be a recall, ever. Sometimes manufacturers change things to improve or just to rid a terrible design entirely.

Sometimes they do things a certain way because they have a preferred preference on what's important to them. I may have a different preference on what's important to me and change how I do things.


I don't see anything wrong with mechanics talking about how they do things and what works for them. It builds a knowledge base. Not everything has to be exactly done according to the FSM. No Yamaha reps are going to arrest you. I've had Yamaha reps in my shops straight up say, well..the FSM says to do it this way, but most of our techs do it this way....

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Actually, with the seals (and tension spring) OUTWARDS, salt water (if run in salt water) can get to the springs easier and fail quicker..

My LU, upper drive shaft seal spring failed as such (no leakage or water intrusion-caught it soon), actually it was GONE..

[walleye1]

Just stating a point [fact] bos