2004 HPDI not getting Oil Transfer

[jkk520vx]

Rodbolt,
The pump ran for the specified 180 seconds and shut off. The tank only filled to just above the trip point for the switch SW2. So that could be the remote tank filter/strainer or the pump itself so i can check these out.
Except for the constant alarm, the system seems to now work. Now to get that alarm to shut off!!!
Thanks much,
Joe

[boscoe99]

The reason that I removed my data was because it was based on the engine in its production configuration. Once a motor has been modified then all bets are off. I have no way of knowing what was done and therefore no way of advising as to what may be causing a particular problem.

I would suspect (just a guess on my part) that when the motor was bastardized with Mercury stuff then as a system it would not work correctly. The fix apparently was further bastardization in the form of a cut wire.

How was the main engine harness connected to the motor? Was it a Mercury harness and was the engine harness cut to make the connection? If so, more trouble to deal with.

Here is a production configuration illustration with respect to rigging components to the motor. If this is installed, and if the cut wire on the engine harness was to the only thing done to the motor (a wild guess of course) then it should all work as originally designed. A lot of "ifs" of course.

All part numbers are in this document 2013-MRP-Catalog

[boscoe99]

Rodbolt,
The pump ran for the specified 180 seconds and shut off. The tank only filled to just above the trip point for the switch SW2. So that could be the remote tank filter/strainer or the pump itself so i can check these out.
Except for the constant alarm, the system seems to now work. Now to get that alarm to shut off!!!Thanks much,
Joe

Put Yamaha stuff in the boat.

Yamaha works on a ground being applied to make the buzzer work. Mercury may work on a positive being applied. Different designs, different methodologies.

[jkk520vx]

Boscoe,
The puzzeling thing is that it DID WORK for 3 or 4 years.
The connector to the main engine harness is Merc Adapter with a part number on it as though it was made for that purpose and the connection is a nice heavy duty 10-pin (i think) connector that you would expect to see. The only "out-of-the-ordinary" issue seemed to be that cut wire. The rest of the wiring on the entire engine was not changed or modified from its factory rigging.
Thanks for your help and suggestions and specifically i will need to see if the Merc system uses a constant ground and then activates on a positive signal of if they use the Yamaha system which is reversed.
Thanks,
Joe

[rodbolt17]

the two systems work identically.
anytime the key switch is on the positive side of the horn is hot and the ECU or merc alarm module makes the ground path.
biggest difference is Yamaha single engine doesn't self test at key on.

but your issue is the filter or tubing from/at the remote tank.
it can simply consume oil faster than it can transfer.
after 180 seconds that tank should have refilled and the pump shut off BEFORE it timed out.
however I did post that once before, maybe you just did not believe me.


how did you verify a "trip point"?

[jkk520vx]

Rodbolt, first of all - I ALWAYS believe you but i couldn't get the remote pump to run at all until i connected that cut wire. once i connected it the system responded as it should (except that i have the constant alarm that i need to figure out - any ideas would be appreciated). The fact that it pumped was good and i now need to see if the lack of flow is the filter/strainer at the remote tank; the pump going bad; or a kinked hose.
As for determining the trip point, in my first post i mentioned that i had tested all of the float switches. When i tested these I also measured from the top of the cap to the 3 points that they came on and shut off. I then marked the side of the main tank accordingly so that i know when the pump should be triggered on/off.
As for the constant alarm with the black wire from the remote tank connected i determined the following:
1. if i leave it connected but disconnect the connection where the trim meter and oil level warning indicator wires connect, the constant alarm stops. This is the connection that has black, pink, and gray wire from the trim meter connecting to the black/red, pink, gray and green/red wires going to the oil level warning indicator (which i don't have except for the alarm).
2. so disconnecting either the of these stops the constant alarm.
3. The voltage at the alarm for the "residual" buzz is 1 volt but is zero if i disconnect the main tank float switch.
Any ideas here would be appreciated.
I am putting in the correct multifunction gage, harnesses, ignition switch, etc. this week.
Thanks again for your guidance

[rodbolt17]

if your using the merc buzzer its a piezio device, will leave a residual hum if used on a Yamaha.

the wire colors on the merc harness are diffent colors than the Yamaha but have the same keyswitch functions.
blk is ground,yellow/blk is choke, not used, purple is ign, tan blue is alarm horn.
light blue is trim up,light green is trim down, yellow/red is start.brown/white is trim send,gray is tach send
blk/yellow is kill .
red is constant 12v

on the Yamaha blk is grnd,yellow is key on 12v,brown is start,lt green is trim uplight blue is down.
dark blue is choke,not used on your model, green is tach send,red is constant 12v white is kill pink in the 10 pin harness is audible alarm.

on the engine 4 pin connector,orange is a 5Vref not used on your model,pink is trim seend,blk is ground and gray is overheat visual.
if that gray is plugged in and the 703 box is used it typically gives a constant alarm at key on.

on the 4 pin oil tank connector,brown is 12v anytime the key is on,there is a splice in the engine 10 pin main where it goes to yellow.
black is engine ground.
blk/red is the low oil yellow lamp(open circuit) oil level ok green lamp(closed circuit) for remote tank level.
any breaks in the blk or blk/red between the engine and ECU will inhibit automatic transfer.
blue is ground path for the transfer pump.

voltage DROP tests are mans best friend, even better is CORRECTLY rigging a hull.
on the two wire green/red and green sometines green/white.
green red is low oil red lamp visual when grounded.
green or green white is spliced into the blk/red and controls the green or yellow lamp.

red lamp equals far left bar or arrow.
yellow lamp is center bar or arrow.
green lamp is far right bar or arrow.

with the engine off,key on, engine tank drained and remote tank 1/2 full or more, you should have an audible,all the indicators flashing and the pump will run 180 seconds refilling THAT model and turning off automatically BEFORE the timer runs out.

the 3.1L motors have much bigger tanks and typically will time out about halfway between the marks.

with an ohm meter you can tie into the green/white or green, to ground and watch it switch.
most likely will need an analog meter as most digital meters are to slow.

see how easy precision blend actually is?

[boscoe99]

see how easy precision blend actually is?

Compared to the Mercury oil transfer system I would have to say that the Yamaha PBS is a Rube ****berg system.

Only complaint I have with the Merc is their use of a nylon drive gear.

[rodbolt17]

then you have never had to deal with all the merc ****berg 2.5 psi check valves and the cracked engine tank caps.

yamahas system is incredibly simple, dirt reliable AND if rigged correctly will mostly troubleshoot itself,,,,,, IF and only IF the tech has an understanding that several things are happening at once.

[jkk520vx]

I know it has been a week or two since i last posted to this issue but i finally bit the bullet and purchased the correct multifunction gage and harness, new main harness, starter switch, etc to properly rig the 200 HP 2004 HPDI.
I just got off the water and have an additional quesiton.
I hooked up a 12 volt light in parallel with the remote tank pump leads to let me know when the pump came on and when it shut off. Everything seemed to work as it should as far as the pump coming on at SW2, it ran for 78 seconds and then shut off when it tripped SW1.
The question that I have is that the every time i turned off the engine and then restarted it the pump came on for approximately 20 - 30 seconds and then shut off again. When I took off the cowling to check the level in the main engine tank it was at or near the trip point for SW1. So I don't understand why the pump is kicking on (and i don't read anywhere that anything other than SW2 should kick on the pump.
ANY IDEAS??
Thanks!!

[rodbolt17]

most systems will work like that.
older systems will run even longer.
be happy
go boating.

[freddytheboater]

I had the same exact problem on my 300 hpdi (my friend on his as well
. My mechanic installed a relay & its been running like a charm
For years. My friend's as well

[rodbolt17]

find a real mokanik.
that system works well as designed and doesn't need modifying.

its an incredibly simple system.