NO FUEL... fuel pump not running - 2004 200hp 2 stroke saltwater ?

[Junglejim03]

PANASONIC.... you were about 25 minutes too late.... or I was 25 minutes too impatient .... bought ALL of the 2004 manuals... cost me $20.
post that link to any other idiot who might be able to read a wiring diagram.

not looking at plate... but invoice... from boat purchase 2004... motor is SX200TXRC
Manual part number LIT-18616-02-80 (per yamaha) ... for SX200C in my case... also sx150c, vx150c dx150c
I am correct on the manual.... sx200c...?

TROUBLESHOOTING.JPG

I am pretty sure I am right past number 2... fuel pressure is out of specification.
When i used a screw driver to release the rail pressure with a screwdriver... it just trickled out.
I am pretty sure the 30-A fuse is not blown.
i am pretty sure the pump will pass run...
have no idea on the relay.... gotta find the damn thing

I have printed out the wiring diagram in color on a "D" size print... 24"x36"
concern i have is that the power for the pump.... is also for EVERY fuel injector...
I have attached it below... confirm you see what I see....

in the morning... i will disconnect the two wires... blue and red... isolate the pump... and apply 12 volts...
i can only go by sound and vibration.... as i believe i have then powered down the injectors... and cannot "Hotwire" a run condition.

HEY GUYS... just out of curiosity... if the pump runs... have i destroyed the low pressure supply diaphragm pumps.... ?
and those guys are driven how?

I know i am driving you guys nuts with the details........ i used to commission power plants and refineries for a living... lots of moving parts and wires
trying ot follow logic tree.... ECU... is a PLC... programmable logic con*****er... ladder logic programming
problem is... that damn motor does not look like a refinery

[Junglejim03]

Wait....
I have power on red now

if I disconnect the blue (neg/ground). I take the high pressure fuel pump out of the circuit with pump return path to ECU through high pressure fuel pump resistor

take the blue on pump to ground... same test
ECU is no longer governing pump run condition
If pump fires off. Start should be “possible”
resistor is probably there to not fry ECU

[panasonic]

I am not trying to get you to have the engine to run with battery hooked to pump. I suggested you Isolate the pump from rest of the engine wiring and simply test the pump operation. Just long enough to see if runs....don't want to run the pump dry if there happens to be no fuel in there.

If it runs on the battery, then work backwards with wiring diagram from there to find out why no power to the pump.

Simple troubleshooting...ONE thing at a time.

[Junglejim03]

I am sure I am confusing... this boat is not on dry land on a trailer...
for each simple wiring test... i go down... climb on boat... remove cover... make 5 minute test... replace cover... gather all tools... climb off... ride back to house.
post results... wait for further instructions... yes... one test at a time... but if one is good or bad... i would prefer to go to next test... and get that result as well.
WITHOUT the wiring diagram... And the Manual... I was poking in the dark

I too am in full understanding of one test at a time... i am trying to understand system... so i can do one test at a time... get result...
Go to next test... one at a time

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Test One 3? is already completed
then work backwards with wiring diagram from there to find out why no power to the pump.

in first post.... I stated this
99yam40 - suggested test at fuel pump... it does have voltage
he said that ECU.. controls negative.
followed his test... does get power to pump, as wired?

i found a good ground... and checked positive on the pump lead...
The fuel pump gets 12.4 volts at key on.
There is power to the pump. done that test.

____ took additional test....
... Checked leads across terminals on pump
There is no return negative path... or pump has no continuity.

No return path. Yes it is governed by ECU... (resistor could be bad)... as shown by wiring diagram i got near midnight last night.
does pump run isolated... provide enough fuel to fire off... if pump will run direct wire... fuel should go to injectors
>>>>>>>>>>>>>provide neg path to isolate pump.... this was my DUH comment... didn't thing of this next step)

Test Two...

i have 12.4 power to pump... as wired (without removing positive lead)
can just unass neg... and provide ground to check..

No chance of shorting injectors... or injectors not providing fuel to engine... IF i get fuel this way.

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This is following your instructions above
simply test the pump operation. Just long enough to see if runs

NEXT... if pump just runs) and and no fuel ... i would prefer to test if fuel is GETTING to high pressure pump...
without opening high pressure pump assembly pot
if no fuel in pot... then electric test is a mute point....
???????? How do the low pressure pumps that supply pot work... not electric...

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Manual also gives complete list of necessary parts to operate under each condition. (logic tree... items necessary for each condition)
kill switch is listed as necessary for run... shows default state as open at bottom of wiring diagram.

ANYTHING... I state.... I am looking to see if my understanding is correct...

THANK YOU GUYS SO MUCH...
i just get ahead of your suggestions... as if we were standing next to each other... under the shade tree

[Junglejim03]

Hey... i really would prefer to be doing this

IMG_0112.jpg

[boscoe99]

I am reminded of the tale about the old bull and the young bull walking down the pasture of life when they come over the hill and spot 10 beautiful young heifers down in the valley below.

[Junglejim03]

I have worked in 33 countries and 47 states... ran 10 simultaneous jobs worldwide... calls from pakistan at 0100 for debugging... and had to work in all those countries.
i need two knees... a back fusion.. a new shoulder...
i am not sure which bull you are referring to, which one you think i am... but... I am pretty much the old one... the pasture is when the cowling cover is off.

[pstephens46]

Low pressure fuel pumps work off of crankcase pulse pressure I believe. Squeezing primer ball will manually fill the vst where hp pump resides.

[Junglejim03]

okay... primer bulb throws plenty of fuel through to pot.... lucky not aimed at myself.

comments.JPG

Relay is closing... as key on has 12+ at positive on pump
Motor is faulted... or bound... 12 v + at return...
Neg has connector right at pump... goes up to resistor... right there... two inches away.

disconnected at that point took to ground...

tons of current going through pump...
12 guage jumper got hotten hell within a minute...

ELECTRICAL IS A okay.... and I have a schematic now to chase stuff from other deleted post.

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[Junglejim03]

Alrighty then....

voting time... is pump trash... or overloaded?
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UH...wish... pump is deadheading to injectors. (if wishes were fishes...)
no fuel in rail....

before pulling pump...

drain.JPG

remove drain plug.... see if fuel in pot?
flush several times to win the lottery and see if trash clears?
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Gotta pull out pump....

What is recommended method for access...
disconnect all hoses... pull out the mounting bolt/bolts...only see one on bottom of pot
Hanger thingy shown off back of pot...

take to bench... try not to f up gasket...
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see if pump is garbage?

or if simply... intake is clogged... and pump is overloading due to no way for suction?

clean filter... etc...

and back to the BULL... just been trying to get all 10 heffers in one pasture

[walleye1]

If you are not getting fuel in the vst when squeezing the primer bulb I beleave there is a in line check
valve between the fuel filter and the low pssi pumps. I have seen them stick closed and have to take
them apart and cleaned. FOR ROD [if you can't get it apart use a hammer and punch]

[walleye1]

Just got looking you may not have one, the vx model had it.

[pstephens46]

Alrighty then....

voting time... is pump trash... or overloaded?
_______________________________________

UH...wish... pump is deadheading to injectors. (if wishes were fishes...)
no fuel in rail....

before pulling pump...

drain.JPG

remove drain plug.... see if fuel in pot?
flush several times to win the lottery and see if trash clears?
______________________________

Gotta pull out pump....

What is recommended method for access...
disconnect all hoses... pull out the mounting bolt/bolts...only see one on bottom of pot
Hanger thingy shown off back of pot...

take to bench... try not to f up gasket...
__________

see if pump is garbage?

or if simply... intake is clogged... and pump is overloading due to no way for suction?

clean filter... etc...

and back to the BULL... just been trying to get all 10 heffers in one pasture

I wouldn't be doing any of this at night on the water. Unless I was stranded somewhere.



You may need to replace that VST tank gasket depending on condition.

[panasonic]

I know one thing you are very good at....typing.

It would take me a week to think and type out what you have in this thread and the one you deleted....lol

No further comments from me, never had a VST apart before...and I won't be taking mine apart anytime soon for fun,

Good Luck

[Junglejim03]

HEY GUYS.... I WANT TO THANKS FOR ALL THE HELP!

Have the pump in hand.... think it is toast.... (only reason i say "THINK" is I know how much they cost.
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LAST DITCH EFFORT...

It will start and run for about 5-10 seconds... (dry... a no-no)
Neutral wire gets so hot so fast....
just test wires for +/- on dry land.. out of pot.
tried it twice...

then it seizes up.... bearings whatever... have tons of resistance.
jumped across the bench... so much torque.
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ANYBODY ever SAVED one at this point..... any thoughts on reviving it?... Defibrillator paddles? soaking?... etc.?