2012 Yamaha 225 Dropping

[Jonah272]

Hi all,

I'm having trouble with one of the two 2012 outboards that came on my new-to-me Grady. They are 2012 F225s.

The port-side outboard drops when trimmed up. Sometimes as quickly as in the first 45 minutes, and sometimes not for a day or so. It only drops a bit, but it's enough for the painted portion of the skeg to drop below the waterline by about 1–2", sometimes partially submerging the water intake.

The dealer from whom I bought the boat tells me that if I had a leak, I'd be seeing hydraulic fluid spill whenever I trim the outboard. So far no obvious signs of that. They suggested tightening the 'trim relief' screw, but I've found that screw to be tight already, whether the outboard is trimmed up or put all the way down. Going any tighter would, I fear, run the risk of stripping the screw.

Any other ideas? Could I have air in the line that I need to bleed out? Or could it just be low on fluid? Or am I underestimating how tight that relief screw needs to be?

Again, the outboard does trim up all the way just fine, but holding its position is another thing. For some reason, it seemed to drop faster when the boat first arrived. Maybe I'm working out an air bubble?

[pstephens46]

I wouldn't overtighten that screw. I think the torque specified is 5-7 lb ft. You can start by checking the fluid level. PIA if the boat is in the water. Can you pull it out of water?

[rodbolt17]

me? I would find a dealership that has training certs on the wall.
mostly at a minimum of drive train.
better a master tech.
but you have an internal leak.

[Jonah272]

Thanks. Unfortunately I cannot pull it. Someone told me I may have air in the line. Could that be it? If so, anything I can do?

[pstephens46]

It's going to be hard to work on it in the water. Cold!

[99yam40]

Thanks. Unfortunately I cannot pull it. Someone told me I may have air in the line. Could that be it? If so, anything I can do?

should be self bleeding , and only way to get air is be low on fluid.
if it holds against the trust of motor while running seems strange it bleeds down when tilted up

[boscoe99]

Bleed the system of any and all air. I don't think that is the problem but it can't hurt.

Now what you might try, if bleeding the system does not work, is to tilt the motor fully up. Then power it down for just a nano-second. Building up pressure might, repeat might, not will, cause a leaking check ball or such to seat.

Now if the motors are to be fully tilted up when the boat is in the water, Yamaha will say to use the up tilt locks. Which is why they installed them. With the up tilt lock in place Yamaha says to activate and hole the down trim button until the trim piston have fully retracted into the trim cylinders. Helps keep them out of the elements.

A tilt piston that does not hold a motor up, but otherwise works just fine when the motor is underway, normally does not rise to the level of a defect. Recognizing that the tilt piston and cylinder are not in play when the motor is propelling the boat. Again, Yamaha will say that is why they put the tilt lock on the motor.

[boscoe99]

If you shop for a Yamaha dealer to tear the trim and tilt unit open, good luck. If you can find one that has a Yamaha master mechanic on his staff, good luck getting him to be the one that tears your unit open. Good luck with even a Yamaha master mechanic being able to successfully repair the trim and tilt unit. Those things are fiddly.

[walleye1]

Alot of times it's the gear pump, depends witch pump you have.

[zenoahphobic]

The sag occurs when the engine is fully up. All the fluid has been transferred into both trim cylinders and into the tilt ram. This means all the fluid has moved from the storage tank, therefore critical that it was full, so that needs to be checked for one.
Two, the tilt ram is a lower pressure cylinder that has a large range of travel, and given that at full extension it has pushed the motor at the limit of the fulcrum if you like, where the motor movement on its hinge is at the greatest with the ram travel at its minimum. This all means the slightest drop in pressure or "give" will be translated into quite obvious engine tilt. There will always be this drop when the pump is stopped at the end of the ram movement, due to play in components.
The problem is that you see a difference between the two engines, but is it significant that there is a problem that needs to be addressed? I understand the engine does not continue all the way down again.
As mentioned in above posts, the difficulty in finding qualified work, you could perhaps limit it to inspection and replacement of the tilt ram seals, and maybe if discovered slightly loose (out of tolerance) piston components, that may solve the problem and is the cheapest option. Also the motor and pump can be removed in situ but you will be gambling that a replacement will fix it by assuming the gears have too much play etc.
Follow what was said by others. I am assuming that there is not excessive wear or play or even binding on the engine and the top of the ram pins or shafts, or not a loose TT mounting for that matter; that it is an internal issue with the TT.

[ausnoelm]

Is it possible one of the switches are faulty and actually lowering it down? It's pretty common to have them operate on their own, so, unless you know the motor is "leaking" down, it just might be a possibility?

[rodbolt17]

why not simply have the leaking system fixed?
it aint air. it aint a pump.
could be a check valve, could be a piston oring.
if it will hold a trim position while underway I would suspect a tilt piston or memory piston oring leak.
but that is just me.
nothing "fiddly" about a tilt unit.
it is a simple hydraulic unit just like the brakes on your car.

[pstephens46]

What is a memory piston?

None of this will will happen if the boat is unable to be pulled. Reminds me of the guy awhile back that had the bubbles and steam with his HPDI. He couldn't figure a way to get the boat out of the water. Boat has a F225 on it. How BIG can it be? 25 feet?

[fairdeal]

What is a memory piston?

[pstephens46]

I recall the conversation about the reverse thrust tripping the valve. I was imagining this memory piston being something that actually moves.